For a more detailed biblical breakdown, here’s my other post on it.
Sometimes these systematic constructs come out that have immediate appeal to the intellectual snob in all of us. I was recommended a long time ago to listen to a series called Heart Motives. It breaks down people into four groups: Love Me, Like Me, Respect Me, Perfect Me. It sounds simple but gets strangely convoluted with a major and minor category and a high and low level. A respected Pastor Min, who apparently wrote his PhD thesis on the whole thing, regularly gives seminars that gut punches people with familiar scenarios to connect them to a heart motive. It reminds me of those broad horoscopes that when passed down to the next person is just as likely to describe them.
Call it Heart Motives, the Five Love Languages, the Seven Habits of Highly Effective People (and don’t forget the Eighth Habit), they’re really all fraudulent voodoo pseudo-science nonsense. Pastor Min starts off with some Bible verses about sinful motives and then turns the rest over to his own psychological chicanery. I’m unapologetic about the authority of the Bible; I’m also indignant at its abuse as a jump-off for bad agendas. Even if I were not a Christian, I’d call foul on some of the awful stereotypes and toxic dangers of his ridiculous system. And those who have invested into it as truth practically run their decisions and marriages and future on their so-called heart motive: even by me disregarding heart motives, I’ve been told that this is also a heart motive. I guess there’s some truth to that, except the parts that aren’t true, which is every part of it.
The biggest problem here is that it’s told under the guise of being based on the Bible. These five-point twelve-step constructs are not too far from the Miracle Water scams of Peter Popoff and the arrogant feel-good teaching of Mike Murdock. The only thing worse than an obvious, deceptive charlatan is an entertainer who almost sounds like he’s telling the truth. A clown who removes his nose is still a clown.
I worry about the compromise of relevancy and the need to reach by fake intellectualism. I worry for the tricked and the tricksters. I say nothing new: the fraud will continue. For every businessman using the cross as a sales pitch, that’s several thousand people who instantly turn away from the church and several other thousands getting duped in heart and wallet. Jesus made well known how he felt about stumbling blocks: tie a millstone around their neck and throw them in the ocean. But grace has priority. I would hope we could be so wise to sort the real from the filth.
Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God.
– 1 John 4:1-3a
LOVE.
By no means am I an expert on heart motives but there are a few minor things that I do not agree with. First off, Pastor Min does not regularly give the heart motive seminar, and he does he does not “gut punch to connect them with a heart motive”. Finding one’s heart motive can be an arduous task and though most people may identify with a certain motive initially, many do not find their real motives until actually thinking about it. Secondly, looking at heart motives as a tool to categorize people and guess at what type of person they are is exactly what is NOT supposed to be done. Instead, Pastor Min, as well as many other pastors/speakers who talk about heart motives urge people not to use it to judge people.
Lastly, heart motives in itself is not based on the Bible. Meaning, the theory of there only being four motives and everyone has one is not Gospel. There can be more motives and everyone can have multiple motives, so that is why P. Min says that part alone is theoretical.
Heart motives is supposed to be a helpful tool in order to help someone see the motive behind their sin and to repent and redeem themselves and eventually glorify God through it. It is getting to the root of our sin and repenting.
Thank you for responding with a thoughtful answer. However:
1) The seminar is being presented again at OIL in 2011. I’ve heard the messages, there is certainly unnecessary gut-punching (from his associates who also regularly speak on them). This gut-punching is basically like a horoscope reading of situations that could apply to anyone.
2) There is not a single person who was into heart motives that didn’t also use them to judge, categorize, or predict. At some churches it has momentarily destroyed fellowship. That is the absolute danger of heart motives: it gives one more layered method to judge that we’re better off without.
3) If it’s true that heart motives isn’t based on the Bible, why present it this way? While I agree there’s a possibility it could help discover the motive behind sin, you then assume that the idea of heart motives exists in the first place. How about just: motives. Things like greed, lust, pride, anger, hurt.
I don’t think you set out to change anyone’s mind and I also think there is sincerity behind these ideas, but I would hope people who hear them discern wisely before basing their life on it.
I wasn’t trying to change anyone’s mindset just opening up the possibility that heart motives may or may not be a good thing.
1) If the seminars are gut-punching all four heart motives wouldn’t that make someone broadly apply all motives to themselves. I don’t necessarily see the gut-punching, but I examine it as the speakers trying to help people to see what they truly get emotional about. It is supposed to help self-examination.
2) Again, extremities of an opinion are extremely dangerous. I do believe heart motives are a good tool for examining and repenting of sin and I absolutely despise the way people twist it to judge, categorize and predict people. I cannot say that I have not at all kept all from this judgmental attitude, however, I do stay away from it as much as possible. You mention the churches that have been destroyed by heart motives and my compassion and prayers go to them, however, does that outweigh the people it has helped as well.
The way I see it with every good tool, sermon, message, etc there are always people who twist and conform it for their advantage. From all the seminars I have heard there is always an emphasis by the speakers for people not to judge people. When the Apostle Paul leaves the areas he has ministered there always arises people who use his word incorrectly and twist what was done. Does the blame go on the message or the speaker or the people? Another example, Hillsong church is widely considered very pro-prosperity gospel and I have read articles saying that the church does not teach real Biblical truths, does this disqualify the many blessings people have received through their songs? No, I believe it truly depends on the way people receive it and use it.
3) Heart motives is the basis that everyone has a motive behind their sin. A deep inner lying reason behind everything they do. When I have greed its because I want to satisfied in that thing not God, when I lust I want to be satisfied in physical beauty not the being God will provide for me, when I have pride I want people to respect and honor me instead of God being respected and honor. I think heart motives simply takes it a little further by stating that there are 4 core motives (which P. Min has explained is the only non-Biblical aspect) The way someone explained it to me is that God is the ultimate representation of love, likability, respect, and perfection. Instead of God being loved/liked/respected/perfected, we want to be loved/liked/respected/perfected.
I agree that heart motives is not essential in a person’s walk with Christ but can be beneficial when used correctly. It saddens me that a method in which is supposed to help a person see their sin is being used to justify their sin. Heart motives is ultimately supposed to be used to figure out your motive behind sins and to repent and redeem it for the Lord (That is why there is an emphasis on the importance of the “Repent and Redeem” seminar. Any other use of it is to pervert it.
Thank you for your reply.
Thanks again for your thoughtfulness. I think in theory you are correct: it can be a helpful tool. Personally, in practice I have seen it used as a weapon.
I think the “blessings from non-biblical means” such as what you mentioned about Hillsong can be debatable, but I’d imagine that some of it must be sincere. I would still continue to exercise extreme caution in listening to a message like heart motives; even analyzed apart from biblical means it is a strange and shallow system.
God bless you if it’s helped you!
Hello, I came across this posting and its really hard to fully understand the concept of heart motives when you listen to the seminars and lecture notes alone. And Pastor Min has his background in psychology for his undergraduate degree. And completed his thesis on Heart Motives during his seminary years for the MDIV. After years of personal experiences with counseling people he developed this model of heart motives.
If you really want any indepth understanding its origin, tools, and transformation you have to speak to Pastor Min. Make an appointment in person or by the phone because he explains it more clearly then any other people’s interpretations and lectures about it.
The misunderstandings and the abuses of heart motives come from our own sinful nature to judge and use it against our brothers and sisters. I was a former co-leader in the small groups and none of the pastors and even Pastor Min never told us to use them in our ministry. Its more for your own personal understanding of your own sinful nature and if it fits into this model then there are some initial ways to recognize it and repent for our heart’s desire not being aligned with Christ’s heart.
I have seen some members and leaders misuse and misunderstand the concept of heart motives. Especially when people think about certain heart motives for matches for husbands and wives. It can be helpful to find someone similar or different. And those misuses are usually on the superficial level however most of the people don’t just focus on the heart motives alone to find a complete match towards marriage. Since of course marriage is alot more complex than that. In reality people should take the time to know each other and not just jump to having a conversation or a witchhunt of what your heart motive is.
For me I find heart motives to be very personal not really something you share with people. Its more a method to recognize your sinful nature and to move onto the next step in your walk with Christ. I.e. quiet times.
I have written about it more in depth here:
http://thewayeverlasting.com/2011/04/20/the-problem-with-heart-motives/
There I dismantle its unbiblical, unsound practice. I look no further than 1 John 4:1-3.
I disagree with many things you said. Though you may defend yourself in saying “it was never meant to be” this or that, the truth is in the history of its common use. Heart Motives has been hurtful and occasionally devastating in my ministry and I will continue to speak against it as long as it divides people. Imagine a room full of seriously devoted Christians suddenly turn against each other by labeling H.M.s without immediately realizing they’re hurtfully judging — because they believe it’s somehow acceptable to do so under a “doctrinal system.”
H.Ms is appealing because of its fun-filled language and interesting concept, like a Happy Meal laced with cyanide. Show me any place you can exegetically come to the four categories from the Bible — even one place. It’s impossible. And why should it be “really hard to fully understand”? Do you mean to say it’s so convoluted that it requires massive studying to know its merits? If I can only learn it from Pastor Min, then why does he have others teach it regularly?
In case you think I’m paranoid against all the pseudo-pop-pyschology, I’ve come around to the Five Love Languages because it has been more sensible in helping marriages and remains, for the most part, biblically grounded. So if its history shows proper use, I’m not opposed. It’s certainly less hurtful than H.Ms.
I did my undergrad in Psychology as well. That means very little in the Christian ministry since secular psychology is often in direct conflict with biblical truth. I have no doubt Dr. Min is a wonderful person, but his system is inherently destructive. Also, 1) I highly doubt he would meet with me, and 2) even if he did, I’m afraid (as I’m sure many are that seek his counsel) that he’d simply label me with a H.M. and send me on my way. Why not? It’s more efficient for his ministry. Perhaps I’m unfair in this assumption, but I wager that would be the outcome.
If Heart Motives is “personal” and not something you share, then all seminars about it should cease immediately. Otherwise, you can only protest on the defensive and talk about what it’s not.
I give you credit, JS Park, for speaking your mind. To be honest, I found the exchange on the commen section very humorous. I agree that heart motives is a bunch of nonsense, and I am a CFC alum who used to talk about it, and convinced myself that it had some merit. If anything, it illustrates what happens within cults and the influence a charismatic leader can have on it’s members. Leaders from religious sects, cults, churches etc. and even dictatorships all have the power to do the same thing. Pull something out your ass and if the cult is effective enough, if your charismatic enough, if the members are brainwashed enough, people will believe whatever. Plenty of people at CFC and CFC alum agree with you, they’re just too afraid to say anything.
i’m always wary of people who come to rash conclusions on matters based solely on their personal experiences — it renders an extremely narrow perspective and provides very little evidence to support any argument. of course, everyone is entitled to their opinion but I am more for one who values dialogue rather than brash criticism without substantial support.